IRC log started Sat May 15 00:00:01 1999 [msg(TUNES)] permlog 1999.0515 -:- SignOff Tril: #TUNES (Ping timeout for Tril[sloth.wcug.wwu.edu]) -:- ruiner [nate@ppp427.wi.centuryinter.net] has joined #tunes -:- SignOff ruiner: #TUNES (Leaving) -:- billyboof [hatefull@nrwc-sh6-port215.snet.net] has joined #tunes anyone alive? 12:50am -:- SignOff billyboof: #TUNES (hatefull@antisocial.com) -:- ruiner [nate@ppp255.wi.centuryinter.net] has joined #tunes hmmmmm...... abi: brix brix is a free, not open source, persistent multithreaded multi-user OO computing environment located at http://www.qzx.com/brix abi: tunes tunes is in my head or tunes is a useful nevertheless expedient system. or at http://tunes.org/ or a free reflective computing system or to programming languages what the internet is to computer networks. 01:20am abi: _qz i think _qz is the creator of BRiX, and webmaster of http://www.qzx.com -:- zhy [root@202.98.22.203] has joined #tunes hi -:- zhy [root@202.98.22.203] has left #tunes [] 01:30am -:- billyboof [hatefull@nrwc-sh6-port215.snet.net] has joined #tunes whats up anyone here? ruiner? ruiner is Nater1464 i know abi 01:50am abi? billyboof? billyboof? i don't know, billyboof abi: abi? abi is, like, the little girl borg with a big brain or #tunes' personal little whore or an infoslut or gaklosmontic or flurivostuginuous or xyvarestoplik lmao hahahaa whats up ruiner I've never had a personal little whore before i have... downloading commercials from the star wars movie ahha... i'm reading about dma trying to get a HD driver written... ahhhhhh heh heh i have my mem mgt for the most part... i need access to the HD so i can load stuff and test it now.. abi: dma is a big ass bitch dma? dma is probably a big ass bitch cool abi: billyboof is a fucking god billyboof? hmmm... billyboof is a fucking god wow... i'm brain fried who owns abi? abi: windows? windows is a 32bit patch for a 16bit shell on an 8bit OS originally made for 4bit machines by a 2bit company that can't stand 1bit of competition dma? dma is a big ass bitch I've actually been looking for that saying linux? linux is, like, bloated unix? unix is proprietary. GNU is free software. gnu? gnu is twice as old as Tunes, with less innovation to show for it.. abi: have you seen billyboof? billyboof: wish i knew abi: 2+2? billyboof: no idea damn abi: microsoft dammit abi: who owns you? i don't know, billyboof abi: microsoft? ruiner: bugger all, i dunno redhat? i think redhat is meant for newbies who don't care how to configure linux. and if you try you're screwed abi: ruiner is your big bad booty daddy ...but ruiner is Nater1464... haha abi: ruiner? you are, like, Nater1464 abi: ruiner? you are Nater1464 doh! how do I get rid of the old one? bugger all, i dunno, ruiner die! 02:00am abi: die! ok i'm dead abi: you're alive abi: ruiner is your big bad booty daddy ...but ruiner is Nater1464... abi: are you alive? wish i knew, billyboof screw off abi abi: screw off abi: go away! abi: _qz I'm gonna rip your balls off, so you cannot contaminate the rest of the world! _qz? _qz is the creator of BRiX, and webmaster of http://www.qzx.com abi: _qz? rumour has it _qz is the creator of BRiX, and webmaster of http://www.qzx.com argh! how do you overwrite the old stuff? i dunno... i just figured out how to write shit.. nop? abi: nop? billyboof: no idea abi: nop doesn't do anything nop? billyboof: no idea abi: darth maul says "fear attracts the fearful, the stong, the weak, the innocent, the corrupt, fear...fear is my ally" abi: darth maul? no idea, ruiner abi: nop is a command that doesn't do anything nop? i heard nop was a command that doesn't do anything my own personal whore doesn't listen to me...... abi: abi? i am the little girl borg with a big brain or #tunes' personal little whore or an infoslut or gaklosmontic or flurivostuginuous or xyvarestoplik ah well, I'm getting star wars stuff, I can't bitch too much abi: darth maul is ruiner's little brother abi: darth maul? rumour has it darth maul is my little brother argh! darth maul? darth maul is my little brother abi: leonardo dicaprio? ruiner: no idea 02:10am abi: Leonardo Dicaprio is the fourth Hanson brother leonardo dicaprio? leonardo dicaprio is the fourth Hanson brother rock on! abi: die! ok i'm dead abi: quit! 02:20am abi: i'm bored me too i'm sick of coding, but i haven't coded for like 2 days... which is a really long time.. heh heh I figured out our problem the other day simple solution is often the best one really? what was the solution? 02:40am code it in c and declare the assembly code as such in the c program yeah... inline ASM is a very nice thing 02:50am -:- SignOff billyboof: #TUNES (hatefull@antisocial.com) -:- SignOff ruiner: #TUNES (Leaving) -:- mithris [mithris@t1o22p46.telia.com] has joined #tunes -:- SignOff mithris: #TUNES (Leaving) -:- smoke [smoke@195.96.122.92] has joined #tunes hello. 04:50am -:- aPasc [anin_p@pA28.hbt.southcom.com.au] has joined #Tunes -:- SignOff aPasc: #TUNES (Leaving) * Fare/#Tunes is back -:- iepos [iepos@d12.t1-4.tecinfo.com] has joined #TUNES gakuk, iepos! 06:40am oh, hello fare! howdy? howdy. i've still been playing with cellular automata... I'm not convinced that cellular automata are leading us anywhere in any foreseeable time 06:50am heh heh, but they're still fun! (:-)) sure! 07:00am -:- SignOff iepos: #TUNES (Leaving) -:- AlonzoTG [Alonzo@client-151-200-127-207.bellatlantic.net] has joined #tunes gakuk! 07:50am -:- SignOff AlonzoTG: #TUNES (Have Nice Day :)) -:- SignOff Fare: #TUNES (Connection reset by pear) -:- smkl [sami@MCDXXXIX.rdyn.saunalahti.fi] has joined #tunes -:- SignOff core: #TUNES (going back to france) -:- Fare [rideau@quatramaran.ens.fr] has joined #Tunes -:- iStormy [stormy@rain.futuresouth.com] has joined #Tunes G! hello logic languages are neat...but i can't think of a darn thing i could do with them that i'd find useful (c: just everything modern logic languages encompass functional programming, too see Oz, Mercury so far all i know about them is 3 pages in a text book on prolog or rather, 3 pages on prolog in a textbook on languages no oz in the reviews, guess i'll read mercury Oz is sure in the Review pages ah, it's down in the todo section :( 10:50am -:- norte [ingenia@BE-85-MALA-X6.red.retevision.es] has joined #Tunes hi all -:- water [STRAIGHTGE@206.81.201.25] has joined #tunes hi all -:- norte [ingenia@BE-85-MALA-X6.red.retevision.es] has left #Tunes [] hi any discussion lately? 11:20am logic languages was the last mention what do you want to talk about (if at all)? what would you like to discuss? well, i'm polishing the arrows prototype on squeak today. the logical design of the classes, that is. squeak kept locking up for me if i mouse-clicked in a way it didn't like, it'd suck up all the cpu version 2.4 seems very slow and buggy that's what i have, of course and it is slow. (c: the version i have been working with is 1.2, which has a very lean environment. it's much smoother and more stable. i'll install it then i'll lag now, it's ftping the squeak team should really focus on their memory model. v1.31 ok i'm trying to learn a buncha languages to broaden my horizons before i develope my own cool i've used only procedural imperative languages to this point in that case, you should really look around at languages so far i've read up on smalltalk, lisp, prolog, haven't doone any programming in any of them yet 11:30am they're interesting to work in. their primary drawbacks are a lack of common support from companies smalltalk is my favorite among those, that is. mine too, at the moment, intellectually speaking it's fairly intuitive to work with. have you read about Self? (you know - technical papers?) not yet it's a very interesting generalization (and optimization) of smalltalk it's much faster (so they claim) smalltalk/squeak is interpreted, right? it's based on a byte-code VM - yes. yah...it runs on a vm so is Self. (and lisp and java ...) and python, my current language i toyed with that one for a short time. 89% on the ftp 11:40am and now the smalltalk sources i'm downloading some napier88 papers. * iStormy/#Tunes has grapefruit mouth. )c: ? ate a bit of grapefruit, and now i have sour mouth ok * iStormy/#Tunes needs something sweet. compiling now -:- tcn [tcn@cci-209150250117.clarityconnect.net] has joined #tunes it's running now it started faster good it doesn't have all the cool facilities, but it's stable howdy brian btw, you _can_ speed up 2.4 using a simple message to the system to compact all methods. hi tcn 11:50am iStormy: which smalltalk did you just get? tcn: 1.31 squeak wow. i just got about 30 papers from the napier site. most are directly useful ideas for tunes. water: how would I figure out if 100895598169 is a prime? is that possible? it's possible...might take a while (c: tcn: yes, using proofs. (i hope you weren't thinking of a sieve) 100 billion you'd have to find some useful property of the number I read that this guy Fermat knew an easy way to do it.. I'm wondering if it's true.. hehe (think what that would mean for DES, RSA, PGP...) "this guy" Fermat? heh _the_ Fermat, rather. yeah 12:00pm Usually I hear about the thing he wrote 'I have a simple way to prove this, but the margin is too small..." yes, a few mathematicians (Ramanujan comes to mind) were cryptic but brilliant, and didn't take any notes. it's amazing that nobody's been able to (dis)prove these things, after 300+ years.. or figure out how to factor large numbers not really. most proofs are based on inspiration, creativity, or just damned good luck. maybe Fermat was psychic :) some people's minds just pick up on patterns that others don't see. take the average tunes idealist, for instance. actually that was proofed (the Fermat thing) you mean a^n+b^n = c^n is never true for n>2 ? you mean his Last Theorem applies to that number? tcn: yes if anyone's figured out how to factor numbers like 100895598169 efficiently, it must be an NSA secret :) wow.. this Oz language looks pretty nice.. what are the features? ok. i'm on it's web site right now. 12:10pm it looks awfully large I haven't actually tried it.. but it has a lot of features I'm after it has all the features which makes me suspect it might be overly big (c: distributed execution & storage, encompasses logic/functional/object programming.. i'm downloading now It's not as big as GNU as gnu what gcc, binutils, etc... all the crap you need to compile programs. i didn't mean disk space big 12:20pm brian, you almost done in the navy? no, i have two years 10 months and about 12 days to go (and counting...) unless i make a huge amount of money before then. you can pay to leave early? heh.. a friend of mine got paid to leave the army :) sort of. a review board can decide if you have too many responsibilities to stay in. i suppose that DARPA could pull me out as well, if they become interested in the project. water: how did you get into that kind of shit? 12:30pm into what? navy it's complicated do you really want to know? when he was in high school a recruiter came around and told them how fun the navy was, and he signed up? hardly heh well, i suppose i'll tell when he was in high school a recruiter came around and told them how sailors get the chicks, and he signed up? i had full scholarship to MIT, starting as a junior, but my legal problems due to a trust fund forbade it. in finland recruitors don't come to schools, we go to recruitors or they will send police to get us (this happened to me) 12:40pm -:- SignOff smoke: #TUNES (Ping timeout for smoke[195.96.122.92]) i either had to go to a state-owned school, or not at all. trust fund.. inheritance? yes so you went to annapolis? no texas a&m friend of mine went to annapolis.. sold 10 years of his life.. when i arrived, i decided that i would drop out after wasting some of the money. so that's what i did. that's what I'd do if I went to the state university here :) i spent 16 hours a day learning things, running computer labs, talking with professors, ... and experimenting in psychic research i tutored several people (mostly sophomores and juniors) after about 6 months, i actually had to drop out. i needed a no-brainer job for six years (my trust fund expires when i turn 24, and i was 17 at the time) hehe.. I just pretend I don't have a trust fund cause if the stock market crashes, I won't a job where people wouldn't be able to recognize that my point of view is a little... well... unorthodox. hence the military for six years. any questions? yeah, the psychic stuff... what was that all about? 12:50pm psychology, cybernetics, philosophy, ... i was attempting to formalize the language that i developed in high school. what language would that be arrows? arrows are just objects whose only attributes are two references. it doesn't have a name, although i've described it in the mail list. -:- Tril [dem@sloth.wcug.wwu.edu] has joined #TUNES -:- mode/#Tunes [+o Tril] by ChanServ hi tril yo time to add some more reflection to tunes.lsp.. i'm gathering web research right now. the arrow classes should be ready for posting by tonight. hey brian, what did you plan to do with the trust fund, start a company? i can't do anything with it other than pay for a state-university after it expires.. when it expires, it goes to my parents. wow, that's lame indeed * Tril/#TUNES has no interest in money and are they the type of parents to give it back to you? tcn: there won't be much left. my sister is using it for school. hehe * water/#tunes has to pay for the clothes he wears and the food he eats. 01:00pm anyway, you got plans for after the navy? plenty of them I better not ask :) well, you should ask _something_. obviously you hold some interest in something. 01:10pm Hey, Brian, WHAT are you going to do when you get out of the navy? :) you want a definite singular answer? i have none like that. you'd better rephrase if you want a meaningful answer. it's tcn's question.. i know that. school? work? start a company? be a bum? :) yes :) 2 years is a long time.. you don't know :) what do you mean by that I don't think he knows hell, I don't know what I'm gonna do after college, which is next week you're graduating? yeah. 2-year don't criticize an unknown. someine is messing with my syslog an intruder using imap? someone is trying to overrun the buffer on my imapd. 01:20pm haha what machine is that? the tunes server * smkl/#tunes makes few hax0r attempts too! * tcn/#tunes is looking tril, what's happening to the syslog? someone at compuoffice7.compuoffice.com is doing something so, has anyone read a good paper recently? * tcn/#tunes is ha| 209.50.72.41:80 * Linux 1.3.xx, 2.0.0 to 2.0.34 send him a mail from somone @fbi.gov piping binary files into the imap username or something do you you have hax0r proof imap? water: I'm reading the docs for garnet, a public domain common lisp GUI development system well, I am reading them when I'm at the lab, right now I'm home and no postscript viewer smkl: dunno. ok it looks like some pretty impressive things have been made using it. tcn: OK, I added the host to hosts.deny and they're now locked out tril: the usual stuff? * iStormy/#Tunes uses firewalls. 01:30pm interactive interface design, 2 widget sets, works on X11 or Mac, almost all LISP versions something called "gesture recognition" it even has an arrow class :) for drawing arrows. cool so bespin now has installed 4 lisp variants: rscheme, clisp, cmucl, and guile I'm not counting elisp heh i've got rscheme and cmucl only. (not counting elisp) same here garnet said it works with clisp but I figured I'd better use cmucl anyway, since it probably works better- garnet was developed at CMU, too no, i've got gcl -:- dumbandass [w@ts-2-09.slip.polymtl.ca] has joined #Tunes * water/#tunes is getting principia cybernetica info now. that site is huge.. btw, is anyone here a fan of the music group "Radiohead"? i just bought "OK Computer", and i can't stop thinking about the lyrics. I'm not too familiar with them I think I heard one of their songs once 01:40pm they definitely express some interesting ideas about technology, not unrelated to the Tunes philosophy. is "OK Computer" referring to taking orders from a computer? basically. the first track is about having your life saved by an airbag in a car crash. hehe the metaphors they draw are really grabbing. wait, are they a 70's band? no, they're 90's alternative they're not hte only band concerned about technology i've known that for quite a while. yeah, my band writes a little about that subject -:- Bianca [pc14@infon684.jet.es] has joined #Tunes hello salut, water do you really think tunes will help? Hello I�m from spain -:- Bianca [pc14@infon684.jet.es] has left #Tunes [] tril: if it succeeds, it could. -:- SignOff dumbandass: #TUNES (Ping timeout for dumbandass[ts-2-09.slip.polymtl.ca]) 01:50pm say Tunes puts powerful AI in the right hands not ai necessarily, but a cybernetic system. actually the most important thing we could do is save the internet save it from what? the threat of becoming no longer free which may be a distant threat now, but it's good to be ready in advance. I think internet is a lost cause.. we need a radio net that's not monopolized by govt & industry it's impossible. the internet is a standard for interactions between networks. every network everywhere would have to be owned by a single group. or controlled by a single group there's a difference. control comes in many forms, and the most important form of control on the internet is : WHO WRITES THE SOFTWARE we need to make sure that everyone is free to write software and have it be used.