IRC log started Fri May 28 00:00:00 1999
[msg(TUNES)] permlog 1999.0528
-:- [---^Shavid [myaddress@1Cust30.tnt1.morgantown.wv.da.uu.net] has joined #Tunes
<[---^Shavid> Hello
<BlackPhoenix> hi
>>> [---^Shavid [myaddress@1Cust30.tnt1.morgantown.wv.da.uu.net] requested VERSION  from TUNES
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12:30am
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* BlackPhoenix/#tunes come again and wait for Fare
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<_ruiner_> wb
<BlackPhoenix> what wb is?
<_ruiner_> wb = welcome back
<BlackPhoenix> ooh... these acronyms... or I should say "ooh... ta..."?\
<_ruiner_> funny
<_ruiner_> well, not really....
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01:50am
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<_ruiner_> wb
<BlackPhoenix> hmm... I have really bad connection...
02:00am
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-:- Fare has changed the topic on channel #Tunes to: Reflective Computing System <http://www.tunes.org/> 
-^lilo(lilo@varley.openprojects.net)- [GlobalNotice] Good day, all.  In just a moment we'll be restarting koontz to perform a server upgrade.  It's a fairly major hub, so expect a bit of confusion momentarily.  Thanks!
-:- NetSplit: varley.openprojects.net split from koontz.openprojects.net [08:40am]
-:- BitchX+Deb1an: Press Ctrl-F to see who left Ctrl-E to change to [varley.openprojects.net]
-:- Netjoined: varley.openprojects.net koontz.openprojects.net
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-:- NetSplit: koontz.openprojects.net split from sterling.openprojects.net [08:40am]
-:- BitchX+Deb1an: Press Ctrl-F to see who left Ctrl-E to change to [koontz.openprojects.net]
-:- Netjoined: koontz.openprojects.net sterling.openprojects.net
-:- abi [nef@bespin.dhs.org] has joined #Tunes
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-lilo(lilo@varley.openprojects.net)- [GlobalNotice] Apologies, all.  That added bit of confusion was purely unintentional. 8)
-lilo(lilo@varley.openprojects.net)- [GlobalNotice] Hi again, all.  Our current active servers have all been upgraded to the latest revision level.  Thanks again for your patience!
!chrome:*! hot-damn the openprojects servers rock!
!lilo:*! thanks chrome 8)
!chrome:*! Who wrote the distributed admin tool thingy?
!lilo:*! the current version is netgod's
!chrome:*! well, he's earnt himself some beer! :)
!lilo:*! yup 8)
-:- tcn [tcn@cci-209150250124.clarityconnect.net] has joined #tunes
<tcn> what's up?
<abi> up is above down
<tcn> fare?
<abi> fare is the one to ask about emacs or french and they like to have dead cricket spitting contests
09:40am
<Fare> yes?
<Fare> writing about universal machines (the Lies, Damn Lies thread)
<tcn> heheh
<tcn> well, lisp is universal when it operates on its syntax trees, right?
<Fare> yup
<tcn> that's more efficient than operating on textual source code
<Fare> that too
<tcn> But in Tunes, pretty much all languages will be able to operate on syntax trees
<Fare> actually, CommonLISP is also universal on strings, since you can define your own parser in a standard way
<Fare> tcn: it all depends on what you ultimately consider as the "source", and whether that "source" has an ability to be non-intrusively quoted
* Fare/#Tunes has put all of his hand-edited ~/.* in ~/etc, and has symlinks or autogenerated files as ~/.*
<tcn> good idea
<Fare> suddenly makes things much more manageable
<Fare> you can see the result in ~fare/etc
<Fare> I have the very same set of files on all my accounts (mostly linux boxen, nowadays)
<Fare> I mostly do the same for the /etc of machines where I am root (although these scripts have to be revamped)
<tcn> wow.. look at all that shit
<tcn> :)
<Fare> years of configuration file crap that builds up
<tcn> 523k
<Fare> much less when compressed
<tcn> of course, windoze uses that much space to do much less
09:50am
<Fare> all of it plus essential binaries (scripts) in a 187k .tb2
<Fare> I ought to automatize more things; and have path autodetection for my scripts, with script-producing scripts
<Fare> I also began rewriting my /etc management in scheme, until I realized I was trying to reimplement Tunes so as to achieve that
<Fare> what about retro?
<tcn> oh
<tcn> what about it?
<Fare> 1) how's it going?
<Fare> 2) what's the right way to add a scheme interpreter to it?
<tcn> right now there are about 10 projects going in retro.. IDE, XCOM, I/O, graphics, serial, persistent storage, forth, scheme....
10:00am
<Fare> IDE comes first, imo
<Fare> (or maybe a way to callback real-mode BIOS services instead)
<tcn> To add Scheme: write it under retro/lang/scheme/. Write the 'scheme kernel' in assembler and/or forth, bootstrap it in scheme.  Interface to the object system, device drivers, etc, as needed.
<tcn> yeah, IDE is important. I'm doing it direct.. it looks pretty damn easy.
<tcn> the IDE controller is so much simpler than the floppy controller :)
<tcn> hey, maybe you can explain reification..
<tcn> it ain't in the dictionary, and it ain't in the tunes glossary
<Fare> isn't in the Tunes glossary yet?
<Fare> well, I'll then try to excerpt a glossary entry from the irc log.
<tcn> you've explained it before, I take it?
<tcn> brb
<Fare> lemme see if I have something in my logs/drafts...
10:10am
<tcn> ok
<tcn> man, I've gotta get to work on Retro before I get a job
<tcn> I could be working full-time in a week or so
-:- billyboof [hatefull@ABD073C1.ipt.aol.com] has joined #tunes
<billyboof> whats up
<tcn> leaving..
<tcn> got a meeting
10:20am
<tcn> hey, anyone ever play core war?
<Fare> long ago;
<Fare> but I'm not sure it was the Original core war
<Fare> more likely yet another variant
<tcn> I was thinking about a game like that, using syntax tress instead of bytecode
<tcn> and lots of room for self-modification
<tcn> well, time to go.. email me if you find a definition for reification..
<Fare> ok
<Fare> I'll mail you the glossary entry I write...
<tcn> thanks
<tcn> take care..
-:- SignOff tcn: #TUNES (tcn has no reason)
10:30am
-:- SignOff billyboof: #TUNES (Leaving)
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* AlonzoTG/#tunes greets "Salutations binEng!" :-)
<binEng> hi!
<AlonzoTG> topick?
<binEng> dunno
<AlonzoTG> did you see the mail I sent out anouncing a symposium on prototype development?
<binEng> yes, I guess I did
<binEng> but to speak the truth I didn't quite understand what the topics were
11:40am
<AlonzoTG> =\
<AlonzoTG> I need papers!
<AlonzoTG> papers on how to produce functional AlonzOS binaries from source code.
<binEng> hehe
11:50am
<Fare> zerog<hzerg<o7~ihj
* Fare/#Tunes gives toilet paper to ATG
12:10pm
-:- Tril [dem@sloth.wcug.wwu.edu] has joined #TUNES
-:- mode/#Tunes [+o Tril] by ChanServ
<AlonzoTG> =\
<Tril> :-P
12:20pm
<Fare> :-N
12:50pm
<AlonzoTG> What can I do for tunes?
* Tril/#TUNES  is away: (afk) [BX-MsgLog Off]
<Fare> ATG: 1) go GPL
<Fare> 2) write code, for instance, a LISP compiler
<AlonzoTG> hmm...
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* AlonzoTG/#tunes greets "Salutations tcn!" :-)
<tcn> hey bineng, alonzo, etc..
01:00pm
<tcn> !varley.openprojects.net Welcome to Open Projects!  You are on 1 ca 1(2) ft 14(14).
<tcn> wonder what that means?
<tcn> anyone here?
<AlonzoTG> om
01:10pm
<tcn> well, now I know what reification is :)
<tcn> therefore I'm about 50% closer to understanding Arrow ;)
-:- SignOff tcn: #TUNES (tcn has no reason)
01:20pm
* Fare/#Tunes is away
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<trance> hi
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01:50pm
* binEng/#tunes is back
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<billyboof> whats up everyone
<binEng> notin'
03:10pm
<AlonzoTG> B00F!!!!
<billyboof> ALONZO!!!!
<abi> hooked on phonics worked for me and it can work for alonzo too!!
<billyboof> hahaha
<AlonzoTG> hehehe
03:20pm
-:- SignOff AlonzoTG: #TUNES (salvaging an unused HD from this box...)
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<billyboof> so hows it going al?
<AlonzoTG> just pulled an old 850 off this box...
<AlonzoTG> It hasn't been connected to the motherboard in years!
<billyboof> hahaha
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<AlonzoTG> om
<AlonzoTG> Its going to be my temp drive on my nekst bawx. :) 
03:40pm
<billyboof> nekst?
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* billyboof/#tunes is hungry as a mofo... will bbl...
-:- SignOff billyboof: #TUNES (hatefull@antisocial.com)
03:50pm
-:- HickServ [thrustit@209-68-229-41.dialup.cust.tfb.com] has joined #tunes
<HickServ> hola a todos
<HickServ> como estais?
04:10pm
<HickServ> :(
<AlonzoTG> om
<HickServ> what is om btw?
<AlonzoTG> A mantra
<HickServ> ;)
<AlonzoTG> Its used for contemplating ultimate reality
<HickServ> im see
-:- SignOff binEng: #TUNES (Read error to binEng[195.84.234.31]: Connection reset by peer)
<HickServ> is it the way you spell um?
04:20pm
<AlonzoTG> om
<hcf> om: hinduism, a word of affirmation or assent intoned as part of a mantra or as a symbolic mystical utterance during meditation.
<HickServ> i see
* hcf/#tunes is away 28/05/99 19:27:41 : oh hmm
<AlonzoTG> hehe
<AlonzoTG> Taht's not what my dictionary sayz...
04:30pm
<HickServ> baby baby baby...
<HickServ> c'mon what's wrong?
<HickServ> it's a radiation vibe im gruven on
<AlonzoTG> =)
<AlonzoTG> topick?
<HickServ> wtf is that supposed tomean?
04:40pm
<AlonzoTG> "what do you want to talk about?"
<AlonzoTG> I am thinking of putting a briggs and stratton 25hp motor on my kar. =)
<HickServ> hehehe
<HickServ> shuum shuum
<HickServ> let's talk about os love :)
<AlonzoTG> I Love DOS.
<AlonzoTG> =P
<AlonzoTG> Any braindead moron could write an OS just as good as DOS. =)
<AlonzoTG> But it takes an absolute genius to write anything even one wit better =(
<HickServ> i see
<HickServ> do you know how to multithread in c?
<AlonzoTG> A little
<AlonzoTG> I have studied multithreading.
<AlonzoTG> And I know that it involves the "fork();" call...
04:50pm
<AlonzoTG> but beyond that I really havn't studied the issue, It is not a core part of the language.
<AlonzoTG> I would be happy to help you with a specific problem, though. :)
<HickServ> hmmmm
<HickServ> well im just learning some more stuff
<HickServ> asking questions
<AlonzoTG> the biggest problem with multithreading is synchronization...
<AlonzoTG> For example if you have a function with static variables you are in trouble if two threads try to run it at the same time!
<HickServ> heh
* Fare/#Tunes is back
<Fare> ATG: yeah -- I've formalized that recently
<HickServ> hello kind fare
<HickServ> :)
<AlonzoTG> rats, I just lost wetscrape to a GPF, Ill reboot in a few...
05:00pm
<_QZ> Fare: how would u setup the directories on a 1.6gig non-udma and a 5.1gig udma?
-:- SignOff AlonzoTG: #TUNES (Have Nice Day :))
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<HickServ> wb
05:10pm
<Fare> hum
<Fare> QZ: dunno
<_QZ> Fare: how should i partition my drives?
<Fare> QZ: put swap on the fastest
<_QZ> swap doesnt really matter
<_QZ> i have 192meg ram and never use swap
<_QZ> do u know how reliable the disk striping is?
<Fare> does it work with heterogeneous disks?
<_QZ> well i was thinking i could create a 1.6gig partition on the 5.1gig drive
<Fare> put a spare partition for stuff, and use it as swap meanwhile
<Fare> oh, maybe you can experiment with striping
<Fare> dunno. Never tried
<_QZ> cuz i have a 440bx chipset that uses dual fifo so it can read from the drives faster
<Fare> I would keep enough to boot and backups on another drive, tho
<_QZ> i am burning all my backups to cdrom right now
<Fare> oh, then
<Fare> one problem with big partitions is that fsck takes hours
<_QZ> ok so i make 4 800meg partitions and use disk striping to make 2 1.6gig dirs
06:00pm
<_QZ> how big is yer /
<_QZ> currently im using 200meg of 1.2gig /, 900meg of 1.5gig /usr, 1.8gig of 1.9gig /home and 1.8gig unmapped
<Fare> on my laptop, I have 64M for "DOS" as a boot loader to a UMSDOS partition;
<_QZ> i no longer need dos on this machine
<Fare> then 64M as a format-on-boot ext2 partition for fast boot
<_QZ> what?
<Fare> then 128M of swap,
<Fare> then 2.7G of /
<_QZ> format-on-boot?
<Fare> and 128M special save-memory-to-disk partition
<Fare> format-on-boot: I format this partition immediately on boot up, and it contains /tmp, generated files for /etc, and more
<_QZ> uhh ok
<Fare> also contains /var/run /var/lock and more
<_QZ> so u have no directories in partitions?
<Fare> no. This disk is too small
<Fare> and since I have this format-on-boot partition,
<Fare> I can login, launch X, and do everything even while fsck is running
<Fare> (I spawn a login on tty12 on boot, too)
<Fare> so I don't fear long fsck
<Fare> I'm immediately productive
<_QZ> well booting fast is not important since i reboot once every several months
<_QZ>   7:09pm  up 52 days, 22:43,  1 user,  load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
<Fare> well, so do I. But when I do, there's a fsck.
<Fare> this is a laptop, and sometimes, batteries are emptied
<_QZ> ya
06:10pm
<Fare> the system is meant to save mem to disk before that happens,
<Fare> but is not reliable
<Fare> I once suffered a *very* severe situation when I believed it had saved, but it hadn't, so the mem I restored was old, and had an obsolete disk cache that it began to flush...
<Fare> had to fsck manually, and lost a few files.
<_QZ> ouch
<Fare> nothing unrecoverable, happily
<Fare> but now, I don't trust the automatic save-to-disk anymore
<_QZ> heh
06:20pm
<HickServ> back
<Fare> away :)
* Fare/#Tunes is away (sleep)
<HickServ> bye fare
06:40pm
<AlonzoTG> om
<_QZ> jesus
<_QZ> i just found out why i was using 1.8gig in /home
<AlonzoTG> hehe
<_QZ> i had all the source compressed, uncompressed and compiled for all the shit needed to install E and gnome 
06:50pm
-:- tcn [tcn@cci-209150250107.clarityconnect.net] has joined #tunes
<AlonzoTG> y0
<tcn> hey
<tcn> IDE drivers are easy!
<HickServ> sup tombo
<tcn> writing an ide driver :)
<HickServ> hey qz when you gonna get your new api finished?
<HickServ> im in the mood to code some
<HickServ> :( i can't even write drivers
<tcn> you know asm, right?
<_QZ> i am in the process of backing up years worth of linux shit and then im gonna reinstall
<HickServ> yes
<_QZ> btw, anyone wnat a copy of my linux warez cd?
<HickServ> i know asm
<AlonzoTG> whazzup?
<tcn> so all you need are hardware specs, and you can write drivers
<HickServ> oh
<HickServ> cooly
<AlonzoTG> I need a kernel and a linking loader written...
<HickServ> where do you get access to hardware specs?  
<AlonzoTG> =\
<HickServ> quite a task al
<tcn> logon to tunes.org
<tcn> cd ~qz/borg.qzx.com
<AlonzoTG> by breaking into the corporate hindquarters of the hardware's OEM...
<tcn> QZ, you should put that stuff in your html dir
<tcn> al: write it yourself
<tcn> alonzo!!
<tcn> abi: alonzo?
<abi> hooked on phonics worked for me and it can work for alonzo too!!
<tcn> heh
<tcn> abi
<abi> tcn?
<_QZ> i will move it to my html dir now
<_QZ> ok moved
<tcn> http://tunes.org/~qz
<HickServ> yuou got a dir now qz?
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<HickServ> heheh funny qz
<_QZ> what
07:00pm
<HickServ> http://tunes.org/~qz
<_QZ> heh
<HickServ> finish that api and send it to me
<HickServ> whenever you finsih it
<_QZ> well i guess the api is finished
<HickServ> ok
<HickServ> email it to me
<HickServ> ok?
<_QZ> ok
<tcn> uhh
<tcn> AlonzoTG: you can't use relocations for syscalls
<tcn> you gotta use ints or call gates
<_QZ> dont use ints
<HickServ> they'll tie up the system
<HickServ> binaryalgernon@hotmail.com
<tcn> yeah, you only get 208 of them
<HickServ> later
-:- SignOff HickServ: #TUNES (Leaving)
<_QZ> no they are bad
<tcn> how so?
<AlonzoTG> in the prototype I will simply call the desired segment....
<_QZ> i was using ints and then was reading the pentium manual and it said something that was bad
<tcn> u remember what?
<AlonzoTG> the current specs to my prototype specify that ints be disallowed...
<tcn> what happens if you get one anyway? say, int 123?
<_QZ> tcn: 2.2.7 has awe32 in the kernel
<tcn> qz: no wonder I didn't see it in mine (2.2.3)
<_QZ>  /drivers/sound/lowlevel
<tcn> oh, yeah, it's there :)
<tcn> didn't look in lowlevel
<_QZ> :)
07:10pm
<tcn> it has a wavetable synth, right?
<_QZ> yup
<tcn> i wrote one of them once
<tcn> it was pretty cool :)
<_QZ> sometimes confirmation comes in handy
<tcn> huh?
07:20pm
<_QZ> like just now when i accidentally clicked the delete button when i wanted to move a dir
<tcn> hehe
<_QZ> confirmation always pisses me off until times like now
<hcf> press the undo button
<_QZ> what undo button?
<AlonzoTG> om
<_QZ> im not in windows
<_QZ> filerunner in linux
<hcf> im j/k
<_QZ> the best file manager on the planet
<AlonzoTG> that was "superdos"
<AlonzoTG> 1987
<AlonzoTG> =)
<AlonzoTG> damn that thing was c00l
<_QZ> obviously u havent seen filerunner
<AlonzoTG> I have the binary but it only works on DOS 3.x
<_QZ> windows SUCKS
<_QZ> i have a linux dir with readme.txt and Readme.txt and it works just fine on linux but NOT ON WINDOWS
<tcn> you ever notice how it always capitalizes filenames?
<_QZ> ya
<_QZ> that sucks too
<_QZ> sometimes it capitalizes the first letter and sometimes it does the whole damn filename
<tcn> haha
<tcn> well, I got lotsa work to do.. catch ya all later
07:30pm
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-:- SignOff AlonzoTG: #TUNES (Have Nice Day :))
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<lar1> hey
<BlackPhoenix> what's up?
<abi> it has been said that up is above down
<lar1> abi: forget up
<abi> lar1: I forgot up
<lar1> nothing much...
<lar1> Tril:  You there?  I'm ready to start orginizing those docs whenever... lemme know when
<lar1> bbl
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10:00pm
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<HickServ> evnin all
11:00pm
<BlackPhoenix> or morning...
<HickServ> in ukraine :)
<HickServ> well no
<BlackPhoenix> yup!
<HickServ> hmmmmm
<HickServ> ok
<HickServ> it's 11 hours difference in germeny and california
<HickServ> it must be like 14 hours for ukraine
<HickServ> ah why bother
<_QZ> my personal home dir gzips to 472meg
<HickServ> gunzip was always a funny app name
<BlackPhoenix> what 11 hours? I guess difference between germany and california is 10 hours... and 11 between ukraine
<_QZ> 472681283 May 28 22:36 brand.tgz
<_QZ> any1 want me to email em that file? :)
<HickServ> which file?
<BlackPhoenix> May 29 9:04
<HickServ> is it true that when you go into pmode all the bios ints are cleared?
<_QZ> no
<_QZ> u cant use em
<_QZ> but they arent cleared
<HickServ> you can't use bios ints?!?!?!?!
<_QZ> u need to pick an area to place the idt that area can be at 0x0000h where the ivt is located
<HickServ> heh
<_QZ> but idt entries are 8 bytes each and ivt entries are 4 bytes
11:10pm
<_QZ> so u would have junk in the idt if u place it over the ivt
<HickServ> dammit why is everything so damn funny to me
<_QZ> so u must clear it out before loading it
<HickServ> cli?
<_QZ> cli and masking nmi will prevent any hardware ints 
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<_QZ> but a zero'd out idt entry will cause an exception if an int is called/triggered
<_ruiner_> HOLY SHEEP SHIT!
<_ruiner_> somebody actually talked!
<_QZ> junk in an idt entry can cause the system to crash
<HickServ> you can only have half the number of ints in pmode than rmode right?
<_QZ> no
<_QZ> u can have 256 ints in both
<_QZ> the ivt is 1024 bytes, the idt can be upto 2048 bytes
<HickServ> oh
<HickServ> that makes sense
<HickServ> so in pmode you can't use bios ints?
<_QZ> sorta
<_QZ> u can create wrappers over the ints to switch back to rmode and run the bios int
<HickServ> might as well write your own
<_QZ> but that is real slow
<_QZ> ya write yer own
<HickServ> you'd have to program the pic though wouldn't you?
11:20pm
<_QZ> if u wanna move the irqs
<_QZ> i remapped my the pic in brix
<_QZ> s/my//
<HickServ> cool
<HickServ> i think i shall write a keyboard driver for practice
<_QZ> in pmode u have 32 exceptions that are hardwired to ints 0-31
<_QZ> so u dont really want the irqs sharing those ints
<_QZ> u want some keyboard code?
<HickServ> i got some stuff off your site
<HickServ> what do you mean sharing?
<_QZ> i wrote a program in dos that hooks to irq9 and displays the scancodes
<HickServ> cooly :)
<HickServ> i got just one more question for you
<_QZ> by default the irqs are mapped low
<_ruiner_> you can find the keyboard scancodes on the net
<_QZ> if u dont remap the irqs then they will occupy the same ints as the exceptions
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<HickServ> oh
<HickServ> bad
<_QZ> _ruiner_: so
<HickServ> ok
<HickServ> what is cli good for anyway?
<_QZ> u would have to write a routine for each int that checks if it was an irq or an exception
<_QZ> that is not good, so u wanna remap the pic
<_QZ> cli stops irqs from triggering the cpu
<_QZ> but an nmi can still get thru so u need to disable nmi
<HickServ> but why would you want that
<_QZ> when switching to pmode the timer int will be triggering so u need cli to stop it while u setup a new idt
<HickServ> oh
<HickServ> ok
<HickServ> thank you qz
<HickServ> you will be in my will
<_QZ> it also comes in handy later when in a critical section and u dont want the timer to change tasks
<HickServ> i see cli() a lot in the linux source
<_QZ> critical sections
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<HickServ> yeah like in sys.c i think
11:30pm
<_QZ> ahhh my last file is about to be moved to defiant
<HickServ> :)))
<_QZ> and then i can goto bed and tomorrow i will format this machine
<HickServ> i wonder if alonzo had changed his site
<_QZ> i might not be on tomorrow
<_QZ> or the next day
<_QZ> or ever again :(
<HickServ> no!!!
<HickServ> i will be hopeless
<_QZ> man it takes forever to copy a 450meg file
<_ruiner_> you mean helpless?
<HickServ> heheehe really
<HickServ> i mean both
<HickServ> how dare you question me child
<HickServ> hehehe j/k
<_ruiner_> lol
<_ruiner_> child?
<_QZ> 450meg over T2 takes how long?
<HickServ> fast i suppose
<_QZ> 409 seconds
<_ruiner_> T2?
<_ruiner_> thats ummmmm.......
<_QZ> thats 7 minutes, so WHY does win98 say 10 minutes
<_ruiner_> I've never heard of anybody using anything but T1 or T3 when it came to that stuff
<_QZ> T2 is 7 T1's
<_QZ> T2 is also known as 10baseT ethernet
<abi> okay, _QZ.
<HickServ> man all the kiddies these days are getting fast ass lines
<HickServ> i got 56 k :(((
<_QZ> HickServ: lan
<_QZ> i have 33.6
<_ruiner_> I'm on a 33.6
<_ruiner_> its not what you've got, its how you use it
<_ruiner_> at least when you're talking about computers....
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<ShitServ> :(
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<_ruiner_> lol
<_ruiner_> wb
<HickServ> http://bespin.cx/~qz/borg.qzx.com/OSDP/hardware/x86-ibm/pmode/multitask.htm won't work qz
<_QZ> bummer, he didnt use his 56k very well
<_QZ> i hope i got everything backed up
<_ruiner_> how much does it cost for a T2?
11:40pm
<_ruiner_> I hear that T1 costs about a grand a month
<_QZ> well a T1 is $900/mo here
<_QZ> a T2 is 7 times the speed so...
<_QZ> OK. my life is backed up
<_ruiner_> no way.....they don't actually charge you by bandwidth do they?
<_QZ> i hope.
<HickServ> you must have some money to be able to pay for that
<_QZ> I DO NOT HAVE A T2 CONNECTED TO THE INTERNET
<_QZ> my local lan is T2 speed
<_QZ> 10baseT ethernet
<_ruiner_> I didn't say you did
<_QZ> borg is is connected to my lan and uses a 33.6k modem to dialup to the internet
<_ruiner_> I hear they've got gigabit ethernet cards
<_ruiner_> too bad it isn't gigabyte huh?
<_QZ> multitask.htm is a bad file 
<_QZ> ya but gigabit cards need fiber optic lines
<_ruiner_> doh!
<_ruiner_> heh heh
<_ruiner_> fiber = delicate = bad for use around my house
<HickServ> it's cool i got ethernet in my house
<HickServ> copper though
<_QZ> its not that delicate and it is wrapped
<_ruiner_> heh heh
<_ruiner_> its fairly expensive though
<_ruiner_> at least for how delicate it is
<_QZ> ya its expensive
<_ruiner_> I wish I could run through barbed wire.....that'd be cool
<_QZ> well im going to bed
<_ruiner_> night
<HickServ> it be 50k though :)
<_QZ> redhat 6 had better install good
<HickServ> goodnight  qz
<_QZ> maybe i should make sure the cds are good first
<HickServ> thanks for answering all my questions
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<_ruiner_> the other good references in here are billyboof and alonzoTG.....if you see them
11:50pm
<_ruiner_> I haven't seen billyboof for a while.....and last time I saw alonzo he was away
<HickServ> well al knows a lot about os design he just can't program
<HickServ> we share our knowledge
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<_ruiner_> heh heh.....
<_ruiner_> I can't program either
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<HickServ> i find it helpful
<_ruiner_> well......thats not entirely true
<_ruiner_> I can program in C
<_ruiner_> just not in assembly language
<HickServ> that's a start
<HickServ> yes
<HickServ> assembly does own
<HickServ> i wish i learned it before i learned c
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<_ruiner_> I'm just having problems picking up the language is all
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<_ruiner_> same here.....it'd all be downhill after learning asm
<HickServ> oh
<HickServ> it isn't too hard
<HickServ> just lots of instructions to memorize
<_ruiner_> I've noticed
<HickServ> rcl rol shl sal rcr ror shr sar
<_ruiner_> and I've been trying to figure out interrupts and what ports do what too....thats a pain
<HickServ> add adc sub
<HickServ> on and on and on
<HickServ> hehehe
<HickServ> oh
<HickServ> well yeah
<_ruiner_> are you designing an os or just in here learning stuff?
<HickServ> im at the verge of designing one
<_ruiner_> ah
<HickServ> i want to write a low level language first though
<_ruiner_> any ideas how you're going to go about it?
<_ruiner_> hmmmm....
<_ruiner_> so you can program in your own os once you get the base system set up?
<HickServ> i think the first modules should be done in asm then the high stuff in my lll then even higher i son't lnnow yet
<HickServ> yeah sorta
<_ruiner_> thats my plan
<_ruiner_> get a bare bones os in there.....port over an assembler.....and go the rest of the way in my os
<HickServ> yeah
<HickServ> im formulating an idea about a kernel but i don't know yet
<_ruiner_> I'm trying to figure out a way to make drivers transparent to each other....so they can share resources without conflicting
<_ruiner_> that way I can go with a compiled kernel like *nix os's.....but use win/dos/linux drivers for stuff I haven't written drivers for
[msg(TUNES)] newlog 1999.0529
IRC log ended Sat May 29 00:00:00 1999